关于武汉病毒起源的一些流行误解

Some basic errors commonly repeated in relation to Covid-19 origins

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/354062873_Some_basic_errors_commonly_repeated_in_relation_to_Covid-19_origins

作者是那個調查武漢病毒起源問題的公益國際聯盟D.R.A.S.T.I.C.。这篇论文用数据和资料列举了一些广为流传(一些可能是中俄信息战同志们的成果)的关于病毒起源的误解

一共三十条有兴趣的葱油可以读读,對於澄清一些中國微信上流行的扯蛋會有幫助

E1 ‘SARS-CoV-2 is likely a repeat of SARS-1, with the first cases linked to a wild-life market’ 3
E2 ‘The first official case with onset on the 8th Dec did not visit the Huanan market, but he did visit a local market to do his groceries’ 3
E3 ‘Scenarios where a research-related accident spread not one but two lineages of SARS-CoV-2 (A and B) to two different wildlife markets are difficult to rationalize’ 4
E4 ‘Research-related accident scenarios must account for the fact that the majority of early cases were associated with different wildlife markets in Wuhan’ 4
E5 ‘The WHO mission report shows that the virus may have come from abroad via frozen food’ 6
E6 ‘The zoonotic spillover hypothesis is simple and explains everything’ 7
E7 ‘The zoonotic spillover hypothesis is the most parsimonious hypothesis’ 7
E8 ‘The most likely origin is a standard zoonosis spillover, as historically an estimated 3 out of every 4 new or emerging infectious diseases in people come from animals’ 8
E9 ‘The research-related accident hypothesis is unlikely because the number of high-risk exposures of scientists doing field or laboratory work with samples from wildlife is minuscule when compared to the millions of worldwide encounters of humans with wildlife, including guano collection and the trapping of bats for food’ 9
E10 ‘Zoonotic jumps happen all the time. We estimate that everyday some new pathogen infects a human. Hence a natural zoonosis event is much more likely than a research-related accident’
9
E11 ‘There is no previous example of a pandemic triggered by a lab, at most just a few local outbreaks. Hence the idea that COVID-19 is the result of a research-related accident makes little sense’ 10
E12 ‘There are no documented cases of laboratory infections with previously unknown, but pathogenic, viruses. Thus a research related accident is of very low probability’ 11
E13 ‘The research-related accident hypothesis is very unlikely because SARS-CoV-2 was never in the WIV. The virus was never sequenced’ 11
E14 ‘Since a SARS-like outbreak in China is much more likely to be triggered by a natural encounter with some animal rather than by any lab accident, saying that the recent epidemic may have been caused by a lab accident is simply unscientific and not worth discussing’
E15 ‘The location argument behind the research-related accident hypothesis is not valid at all. Case in point: SARS-1 started 600 miles from Yunnan where the bat populations with the most similar viruses are. Instead the outbreak just started in Wuhan because there are wildlife markets and good transport links there’ 13
E16 ‘The virus was detected in Wuhan because Wuhan has indeed the best detection capability, by the virtue of being precisely the main city in China where coronaviruses are studied’ 13
E17 ‘The research-related hypothesis requires a colossal cover-up. It is thus a typical conspiracy theory of people - often driven by political or xenophobic considerations - who want quick and easy answers’ 14
E18 ‘The research-related accident hypothesis is very unlikely because nobody in the WIV and other labs were infected’ 14
E19 ‘No virus can have leaked from a lab in Wuhan. The WIV BSL-4 lab is very safe’ 15
E20 ‘BSL-2 and BSL-3 labs are very safe’ 16
E21 ‘China is confident that its labs are safe and can handle pathogenic SARS-like viruses’ 16
E22 ‘Field sampling was safe as being done in full PPE’ 17
E23 ‘China cannot share patients’ data because of privacy rules. There is simply nothing sinister in its decision not to share data’ 18
E24 ‘The WIV may have indeed removed access to its viral databases, but they gave a good reason for doing so (fear of hackers)’ 18
E25 ‘Scientists already know what was in that database, and the data there was already published as SZL herself has explained’ 18
E26 ‘The Mojiang miners’ deaths were ‘more likely explained by fungal infections’ 19 E27 ‘The WIV does not culture and isolate coronaviruses, as it is extremely difficult to do so’ 20
E28 ‘If you suppose that a community outbreak happens in China, then by definition it must happen somewhere. So there is no point saying after the fact that there was a small chance that it happened in Wuhan, of all places. It had to happen somewhere and it just happened in Wuhan by chance’ 21
E29 ‘There is still nothing proving that the COVID-19 community outbreak was caused by a research-related accident, whatever the probabilities. So it makes no sense to talk about a possible lab accident’ 22
E30 ‘We know that populations living close to bat colonies in China carry antibodies for SARS-like coronaviruses, so this is actually only the tip of the iceberg and human outbreaks involving SARS-like coronaviruses are very common’
3
分享 2021-09-10

21 个评论

第一推动力 🤬不友善用户
感觉都比较离谱。品葱8月底被攻击前看到过一篇比较靠谱的分析,说是武汉病毒所石正丽她们为了发论文骗经费搞病毒增强研究,后来病毒无意中从武汉病毒所泄露的文章还比较在理。
总之不可能是自然起源,因为蝙蝠体内没有一模一样的病毒,只有相似的。而所谓的中间宿主穿山甲也是假的。自然界中都不存在这样的病毒,如何自然起源?
美国泄露,电子烟肺炎,军运会传播也不可能,如果是美国泄露,军运会早大规模爆发了,更何况军运会包子也亲临现场,没听说有谁感染的。
只可能是武汉泄露,而武汉泄露最大的可能就是那几个病毒实验所。管轶调查第一时间发现证据被洗地,中共军管武毒所,熟悉中共官场办事逻辑的都知道是怎么回事。
美國報告裡面多數支持的那個意見應該是實驗室改造了雲南的病毒, 支持蝙蝠傳人(也大概是五毒所工作人員)也有合理性

反正不需要做這種結論, 只要是黨國的責任即可, 因為真正值得顛覆政權的是後來掩蓋的責任。
fb_china_today 回复 第一推动力 🤬不友善用户
>> 感觉都比较离谱。品葱8月底被攻击前看到过一篇比较靠谱的分析,说是武汉病毒所石正丽她们为了发论文...


蝙蝠体内有没有一模一样的病毒要看五毒所那個數據庫公布以後的結果, RaTG13是石博士自己發布的沒準還有別的

美國泄漏這種說法完全不值得討論, 報告說11月之前開始傳播, 軍運會有傳播的可能
第一推动力 🤬不友善用户 回复 fb_china_today
>> 蝙蝠体内有没有一模一样的病毒要看五毒所那個數據庫公布以後的結果, RaTG13是石博士自己發布...


沒有別的了,最接近的就是RaTG13。如果有其他更接近的,或者是一模一樣的早就被披露出来啦,要知道中共早期一直拼命在找自然来源,最后弄出个RgTG13
fb_china_today 回复 第一推动力 🤬不友善用户
>> 沒有別的了,最接近的就是RaTG13。如果有其他更接近的,或者是一模一樣的早就被披露出来啦,要...


中國有無數的理由不公布, 美國如果不公布可以也理解
第一推动力 🤬不友善用户 回复 fb_china_today
>> 中國有無數的理由不公布, 美國如果不公布可以也理解


是吗?那你说个理由呗。如果自然界真的有Sars-cov-2病毒,为什么没人公布呢?之前的Sars,Mers都是第一时间就公布,传染链也是很清晰的。
fb_china_today 回复 第一推动力 🤬不友善用户
>> 是吗?那你说个理由呗。如果自然界真的有Sars-cov-2病毒,为什么没人公布呢?之前的Sar...


E13 E14
第一推动力 🤬不友善用户 回复 fb_china_today
>> E13 E14


E13,E14只是说Sars2的病毒序列没有出现在WIV中,但这个病毒同样没有出现在自然中。另外Sars1的爆发和Sars2的爆发是不同的,Sars1是自然病毒,传播速度可控,把传染链掐断即可控制在万人以下。但Sars2并不是,因此在比Sars1短得多的时间内迅速爆发
说实话,搞溯源调查还多少股势力啄来啄去的,渐渐把第一时间基于常识的判断都给搞模糊了。中国那么多大城市,为什么是武汉,当然是那儿的virology研究产业了。Made in China的live promotion show.
fb_china_today 回复 第一推动力 🤬不友善用户
>> E13,E14只是说Sars2的病毒序列没有出现在WIV中,但这个病毒同样没有出现在自然中。另...



E13说: ” 实验室起源不太可能因为病毒序列没有出现在WIV中” 这是一种常见的错误

你篡改原文的水平还需要改进

传播力如何这里有专门讨论
https://pincong.rocks/article/35463
第一推动力 🤬不友善用户 回复 fb_china_today
>> E13说” 实验室起源不太可能因为病毒序列没有出现在WIV中” 这是一种常见的错误你篡改原文的...


E13原文是英语:The research-related accident hypothesis is very unlikely because SARS-CoV-2 was never in the WIV. The virus was never sequenced
简单翻译成因为病毒序列没有出现在WIV中,有什么错误吗?
>> 说实话,搞溯源调查还多少股势力啄来啄去的,渐渐把第一时间基于常识判断都给搞模糊了。中国那么多大...


这里主要考察一下战忽局同志们在这个问题上有没有新的指示

的确对大多数葱油不懂病毒学只有懂得共产党就可以明白发生了什么
fb_china_today 回复 第一推动力 🤬不友善用户
>> E13原文是英语:The research-related accident hypothes...


贵国新华社常来断句这一手 你可以参考

中國教科書 “马克阿瑟朝鲜战争是个错误“

原文“如果把战争扩大到共产党中国,参谋长联席会议认为,这一战略将使我们在错误的地点地方,错误的时间,同错误的敌人打一场错误的战争。”
第一推动力 🤬不友善用户 回复 fb_china_today
>> 贵国新华社常来断句这一手 你可以参考中國教科書 “马克阿瑟朝鲜战争是个错误“原文“如果把战争扩...


首先新华社并不是我国的。我国的新闻媒体是CNN,NYT,当然这并不算国家媒体,VOA可能算吧。至于新华社已经被设为外国代理人团队了,并不是我国的。
用简体字并不代表我是中国人。因此你用“贵国”一词显得有些比断章取义还要武断了。其次E13的英文原版:The research-related accident hypothesis is very unlikely because SARS-CoV-2 was never in the WIV. The virus was never sequenced
原版完整翻译如下:与研究相关的事故假设不太可能,因为 SARS-CoV-2 从未出现在 WIV 中。病毒从未被测序
我翻译为“因为病毒没有出现在WIV中”,只是一个缩写,有什么断章取义的错误吗?
就逻辑来说,如果病毒没有出现在WIV中可以排除研究相关事故,那么该病毒没有在自然中出现,也可以排除自然起源。
fb_china_today 回复 第一推动力 🤬不友善用户
>> 首先新华社并不是我国的。我国的新闻媒体是CNN,NYT,当然这并不算国家媒体,VOA可能算吧。...


你还少了 “….这说法是常见错误” (全文都在说这30条错误)

同志们玩这种文字游戏就俗套了 还是隔壁关于“美国是否资助了五毒所”比较有趣

这可能是贵国新的洗涤方向

围观的还是都去那边把

https://pincong.rocks/article/id-35568__sort_key-agree_count__sort-DESC
第一推动力 🤬不友善用户 回复 fb_china_today
>> 你还少了 “….这说法是常见错误” (全文都在说这30条错误)同志们玩这种文字游戏就俗套了 还...


所以你国人都喜欢用“贵国”这种词吗?玩文字游戏的人似乎是同志你吧?你一直都在回避自然界没有出现这个病毒的观点,并且在把讨论的重点引到其他地方吧
fb_china_today 回复 第一推动力 🤬不友善用户
>> 所以你国人都喜欢用“贵国”这种词吗?玩文字游戏的人似乎是同志你吧?你一直都在回避自然界没有出现...



战忽局同志之前都是装反贼挺克制的 新来的需要学习一下
第一推动力 🤬不友善用户 回复 fb_china_today
>> 战忽局同志之前都是装反贼挺克制的 新来的需要学习一下


反贼,战忽局这种梗没有什么兴趣。我只是想告诉你,这30条都没有能排除武汉实验室泄露病毒的可能,因为野外没有一样的病毒。而武汉实验室是进行过病毒增强实验的,这就为泄露提供了可能。就算之前没有进WIV,没有被测序,也不能排出这种可能。
konggang 🤬不友善用户
根据一些文献查明,疫情来源于习近平的做恶多端。如果习能改变残暴的做法或下台换人,疫情也许会消失。
fb_china_today 回复 第一推动力 🤬不友善用户
>> 反贼,战忽局这种梗没有什么兴趣。我只是想告诉你,这30条都没有能排除武汉实验室泄露病毒的可能,...


你现在装反贼晚了点 以后记得吸取教训

这三十条列举一些贵国同志们偶尔用到的扯淡而已

武汉病毒所那一茬 欢迎查阅专题

https://pincong.rocks/topic/topic_id-6238__rf-7698
第一推动力 🤬不友善用户 回复 fb_china_today
>> 你现在装反贼晚了点 以后记得吸取教训这三十条列举一些贵国同志们偶尔用到的扯淡而已武汉病毒所那一...


我什么时候“装”反贼了?我只是问你,野外都没有这个病毒,怎么可能是自然传播呢?你那30条证据也没有找到自然界的天然宿主。而且我一直认为是武汉病毒所传播的。这个观点你的同志们是反对的吗?

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